Friday, December 09, 2005

Agreement on Patriot Act

NYT reported House and Senate negotiators reached agreement today on reauthorizing the USA Patriot Act

Very good news.
, the sweeping anti-terrorism measure that granted the federal government new powers after the attacks of Sept. 11, 2001, a Republican Senate leader said. The accord was reached after arduous negotiations about two of the law's most controversial provisions: involving the government's access to library and business records and the use of roving wiretaps, Senator Arlen Specter of Pennsylvania, the chairman of the Senate Judiciary Committee, said in announcing the deal.

Under the accord, those retooled provisions would be extended for four years, Mr. Specter said. The House had wanted them extended for 10 years. In negotiations, there was a move to extend them to seven years, but Mr. Specter said the four-year arrangement was much better, because a seven-year extension would have called for a new debate in a presidential election year.
I dont see a problem doing it during a presidential election year; it might make for some interesting debate, but at least we have them for four more years, and the rest is permanent. I wish they had made the roving wiretaps permanent.
Fourteen other, less controversial sections of the law will be extended permanently, assuming final passage of the agreement just announced. Mr. Specter said he was confident there were enough votes in the Senate to avoid a legislative stall, or filibuster, and enough votes to defeat a filibuster if one comes, even though vigorous opposition was voiced immediately after Mr. Specter announced the agreement.

12 comments:

Anonymous said...

I keep hearing people say Saddam and bin Laudin are a threat to freedom. They don't vote and don't make laws, so they don't have the opportunity to be a threat to our freedom. Unfortunately our spineless politicians are more then happy to abandon our civil liberties with fools cheering them on.
-John Gillnitz

Don Singleton said...

Osama was certainly a threat to 3000 people that used to work in two buildings that used to be in NYC.

If you are behaving yourself, you should never be affected by any of the provisions of the Patriot Act

Anonymous said...

Don Singleton said...

Osama was certainly a threat to 3000 people that used to work in two buildings that used to be in NYC.

If you are behaving yourself, you should never be affected by any of the provisions of the Patriot Act


Don, you're an idiot. Cowards like you, who think that they can somehow make the world perfect and safe by giving lots of power to a largely unaccountable government are unfit to be free and Americans, they are only fit to be slaves and whores.

Don, here's something for you and your conservatard buddies to consider, 3,000 Americans were killed on September 11th and yet not a single person in the FBI, CIA or any of the other government agencies charged with preventing events such as 9/11 has lost his job. The Republicans not only failed to fire anyone (well except for Sibel Edwards) they've also given these idiots medals and increased their budgets and their power to poke and pry into our lives.

Don Singleton said...

Don, you're an idiot.

I don't think too highly of you either, John.

Cowards like you, who think that they can somehow make the world perfect and safe by giving lots of power to a largely unaccountable government are unfit to be free and Americans, they are only fit to be slaves and whores.

Making the world perfect, or even safe, is clearly an unreachable goal. Expecting a government to protect you, without giving them some power to do it, is unrealistic.

If you think the terrorists would treat you better than the US Government, why don't you volunteer to take the place of one of the hostages in Iraq.


Don, here's something for you and your conservatard buddies to consider, 3,000 Americans were killed on September 11th and yet not a single person in the FBI, CIA or any of the other government agencies charged with preventing events such as 9/11 has lost his job. The Republicans not only failed to fire anyone (well except for Sibel Edwards) they've also given these idiots medals and increased their budgets and their power to poke and pry into our lives.

And we put one of the idiots that was primarilly responsible (setting up the wall preventing the CIA from talking to the FBI, on the 911 Commission to to try to hide what she did.

Anonymous said...

Don, perhaps your phone can be the first to be part of the roving wiretaps.

I know Republicans like eliminating civil liberties, but they're always the first ones caught licking prostitutes' toenails.

Are you behaving yourself? Do you really want your personal life spilled out in the public arena?

Those that pretend to be pious, like Don, are the ones that have the most to hide. Just ask Bill Bennett, Rush, O'Reilly, Cheney, Frist, Delay... etc

Just like the ones that want Wars of Choice are the same people that would never ever volunteer to put themselves in war.

If you think it's so important to conquer and occupy Iraq in a preemptive war that was clearly based on lies, wouldn't you be one of the boots on the ground? Staying at home with your war pom poms is the cowardly thing to do.

The troops don't deserve your cowardly rhetoric and you don't deserve the unquestioning bravery of the troops.

bok bok Chicken Hawk

-- Lars Gruber

Don Singleton said...

Don, perhaps your phone can be the first to be part of the roving wiretaps.

I doubt it will do them any good, but I have no objection

I know Republicans like eliminating civil liberties, but they're always the first ones caught licking prostitutes' toenails.

Never heard of anyone doing that, but then I don't know that many Democrats.

Are you behaving yourself? Do you really want your personal life spilled out in the public arena?

Not particularly, but then noone but suspected terrorists are subjected to Patriot Act investigations, and those results are not made public.

Those that pretend to be pious, like Don, are the ones that have the most to hide. Just ask Bill Bennett, Rush, O'Reilly, Cheney, Frist, Delay... etc

What about Bill "smoke the cigar, Monica" Clinton.

Just like the ones that want Wars of Choice are the same people that would never ever volunteer to put themselves in war.

If you think it's so important to conquer and occupy Iraq in a preemptive war that was clearly based on lies, wouldn't you be one of the boots on the ground? Staying at home with your war pom poms is the cowardly thing to do.


I am 62 years old and physically disabled. I doubt I would be that much use over there, but if I could go, I would.

The troops don't deserve your cowardly rhetoric and you don't deserve the unquestioning bravery of the troops.

I dont know what is cowardly about my rhetoric, and I certainly appreciate the work our brave troops are doing. I am not among the white flag waving Democrats that want to pull them out just as Iraq is about to have its third election this year, this one to elect a Parliament for four years.

Anonymous said...

Don Singleton said...
Osama was certainly a threat to 3000 people that used to work in two buildings that used to be in NYC.

The whole concept of terrorism is that the target country will freak out and turn into a paranoid police state. The only way to defeat terrorism is not to be terrified by it. Bush Co. is doing their damnedest to do exactly what bin Laudin wants them to do.

If you are behaving yourself, you should never be affected by any of the provisions of the Patriot Act

Really? Tell that to Sami al-Hussayen, Sami Al-Arian, Karim Koubriti, Ahmed Hannan, Farouk Ali-Haimoud and Abdel-Ilah Elmardoudi. The Patriot Act doesn't have a good track record so far.
-John Gillnitz

Tom said...

Why do you hate the Constitution so?

This "Patriot Act" (what a lying name!) indefinitely suspends five of ten clauses in the Bill of Rights. It's un-American.

And now the Bush government is desperately fighting for the right to torture prisoners. It's un-American!

It would be completely unacceptable under any circumstances -- it's even more intolerable considering that the government had all the information it needed to prevent 9/11, it was already too obsessed with Iraq to pay attention. Bush was told in writing that terrorists were planning to fly airplanes into buildings in lower Manhattan -- he did nothing -- and the Towers were destroyed.

There was complete and utter incompetence up and down the line but not one single person was fired -- instead, our rights were taken from us, our sacred Constitution spat upon, and now chicken-hawks like you want to make the suspension of the Bill of Rights permanent.

If you are behaving yourself, you should never be affected by any of the provisions of the Patriot Act.

There was a time when you could only be arrested if you broke laws; where you were innocent until proven guilty.

Now if some faceless American official decides that you are "behaving badly", with no due process, with no oversight or accountability, your freedom can be stripped from you, your name erased from the earth and your life extinguished at the hands of of American torturers. This is no hypothetical, this has happened repeatedly all over the globe, and you have seen the pictures to prove it.

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

Don Singleton said...

Why do you hate the Constitution so?

I don't hate the Constitution. But the Constitution is not a suicide document.

This "Patriot Act" (what a lying name!) indefinitely suspends five of ten clauses in the Bill of Rights. It's un-American.

No it does not suspend them. It may encroach on them a bit, particularly if you are a terrorist. But if you are a terrorist I don't care.

And now the Bush government is desperately fighting for the right to torture prisoners. It's un-American!

No we do not torture prisoners. But there is a big difference between torture and degrading treatment.

It would be completely unacceptable under any circumstances -- it's even more intolerable considering that the government had all the information it needed to prevent 9/11, it was already too obsessed with Iraq to pay attention. Bush was told in writing that terrorists were planning to fly airplanes into buildings in lower Manhattan -- he did nothing -- and the Towers were destroyed.

If he acted to block every possible threat anyone put in writing. But had Clinton gone after Bin Laden when he had a chance, the buildings would remain.

There was complete and utter incompetence up and down the line but not one single person was fired -- instead, our rights were taken from us, our sacred Constitution spat upon, and now chicken-hawks like you want to make the suspension of the Bill of Rights permanent.

Are you foolish enough to believe that garbage.

If you are behaving yourself, you should never be affected by any of the provisions of the Patriot Act.

Precisely

There was a time when you could only be arrested if you broke laws; where you were innocent until proven guilty.

Now if some faceless American official decides that you are "behaving badly", with no due process, with no oversight or accountability, your freedom can be stripped from you, your name erased from the earth and your life extinguished at the hands of of American torturers. This is no hypothetical, this has happened repeatedly all over the globe, and you have seen the pictures to prove it.


You must be smoking those funny cigarettes again

You should be ashamed of yourselves.

I am proud of myself, and even more proud of our armed forces.

Don Singleton said...

Tell that to Sami al-Hussayen, Sami Al-Arian, Karim Koubriti, Ahmed Hannan, Farouk Ali-Haimoud and Abdel-Ilah Elmardoudi. The Patriot Act doesn't have a good track record so far.

Sami Al-Arian still has more than half of his charges to face, and many of the others are are not innocent, but it would have revealed too many sources and methods secrets to prosecute them in US Courts

tommo said...

Asleep at the wheel on 9/11, Shrub and his friends broke Afghanistan. They spit on our friends and allies. Then they broke Iraq. Now, while we're trying to put the pieces back together, he's still swinging his shriveled little stick at Syria, Iran, and North Korea. They've charged our national debt "credit card" to the max. Meanwhile, they've shredded the Constitution and the Geneva accords, let New Orleans get broken and simply walked away, and have corrupted our voting systems.

We Dems really have out work cut our for us, repairing the damage done by The Bush Crime Family.

Don Singleton said...

Asleep at the wheel on 9/11,

It was very early in his first term, and Bush made the mistake of following what Clinton had done

Shrub and his friends broke Afghanistan.

And it is now a free country, and no longer a haven for terrorists

They spit on our friends and allies.

Over 30 nations participated in the Coalition. Unfortunately countries making a lot of money from Oil For Food did not join.

Then they broke Iraq.

Who elected an interim government, wrote a constitution, got it approved, and Thursday they will elect a four year Parliment.

Now, while we're trying to put the pieces back together, he's still swinging his shriveled little stick at Syria, Iran, and North Korea.

Two of which are threatening Iraq, and two of which are trying to develop nuclear weapons to threaten all of their neighbors.

They've charged our national debt "credit card" to the max.

Republican CongressCritters spent like Democrats. We need to stop that.

Meanwhile, they've shredded the Constitution and the Geneva accords,

Both are still intact

let New Orleans get broken and simply walked away,

The main problem in New Orleans was an incompetent Democratic Mayor and an incompetent Democratic Governor.

and have corrupted our voting systems.

Not sure what you are talking about

We Dems really have out work cut our for us, repairing the damage done by The Bush Crime Family.

And if you cant come up with anything but hatred, you are going to be the minority party for a long time